--- Log opened Sat Sep 01 00:00:10 2007
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03:49 < Wombert_> sleep time! :p
03:49 < Wombert_> two or three hours ;:p
03:49 < Wombert_> laters
03:54 < nfq> laters.. sweet dreams!
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06:23 < v-dogg> huomenta
06:32 < liutis> huomenta :)
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07:42 < _trophaeum> http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/31/1846214&from=rss BWAHAHAHA
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07:43 < MugeSo> huomenta
08:00 < MugeSo> I want to send a e-mail as a result of my action, and the content of e-mail should be rendered with any template.
08:00 < MugeSo> I think this function is view in MVC model. 
08:03 < MugeSo> but, no surprises, agavi's view can not send e-mail.
08:04 < MugeSo> hmm...
08:08 < MugeSo> even if sending e-mail is not a veiw in MVC, features of agavi's veiw such as caching and rendering are also useful to sending email.
08:09 < MugeSo> how can I do?
08:22 < MugeSo> I'll try to make a ActionFilter grabs output and sends email.
08:23 < MugeSo> bye
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09:29 < _cheerios> hyvää huomenta
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11:19 < _cheerios> v-dogg: http://i1.tinypic.com/4ukuxq9.jpg
11:25 < v-dogg> :)
11:25 < ttj> Nice.
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11:46 < ttj> My god... I want to kill me upstairs neighbor.
11:46 < ttj> For some reason s/he has to play Cher at loud volumes when everyone surely has a hangover.
11:51 < ttj> "Duu juu biliiv in laif äääfter loooov..."
11:54 < ttj> "Beibi its aal oor naathing nau! Dount vanna ran änd ai käänt vaak aut!"
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15:25 < _cheerios> digitarald, you showed something akin sprintf() for mootools here earlier?
15:25 < digitarald> a template system
15:25 < _cheerios> i have piece of text where i'd just need to replace values for indexes, not sure how to go about it other than that
15:26 < digitarald> let me commit my latest version
15:26 < digitarald> its in my branch
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20:26 < _cheerios> deathproof :po
21:15 < _cheerios> when finnish location names are turned into English... http://www.hs.fi/kaupunki/artikkeli/Hello+I+come+from+Three+Ass+%E2%80%93+p%C3%A4%C3%A4kaupunkiseudulle+ehdotetaan+englanninkielisi%C3%A4+paikannimi%C3%A4/1135229973714
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07:31 < _cheerios> jee!
07:34 < _cheerios> waking up and ordering stuff from Amazon. i hope the decisions are good this early in the morning.
07:39 < _cheerios> Finland is so expensive. Amazon price $26 + S&H, versus Finland 41e + S&H (online) or 59e from a major bookstore.
07:43 < MikeSeth> fuckers dont even ship to where I live
07:44 < MikeSeth> or rather, they do, but they shipment misses the destinations
07:44 < MikeSeth> I orderd a book in first week of April and got a delivery failure notice two weeks ago
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07:49 < _cheerios> move out from Bahgdad, silly!
07:49 < _cheerios> the delivery does take time. 2-4 weeks. no rush.
07:58 < JanK_> do someone have a simple app with models?
07:59 < JanK_> for example with the defualt propel models
08:01 < JanK_> agavi needs the popular blog-example :)
08:34 < _cheerios> check out v-dogg's cms for tips?
08:35 < v-dogg> yeah.. should find the time to polish it up
08:39 < v-dogg> JanK_: http://groups.google.com/group/agavi-users/browse_thread/thread/8262f274e4dda261/
08:41 < JanK_> thanks
09:45 < splatch`> hello
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10:23 < MikeSeth> mmm how do I tell the FPF *not* to refill the values?
10:24 < v-dogg> $req->setAttribute('populate', false, 'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter');
10:24 < MikeSeth> thought so.
10:24 < MikeSeth> thx
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11:48 < selloso> Hi together, I got a question concerning agavi with propel. I placed my project-config.php by propel in the the config dir, configured it in the databases.xml and so on. Then i put the "main classes" by propel in the audoload.xml The are loaded but i'm gettin erros while including the files that are referenced in the propel class. How can i solve this problem?
11:51 < selloso> I know i could extend the include path, but i guess there has to be a better way
11:52 < selloso> oh, i'm using proepl 1.2
11:52 < selloso> propel
11:55 < _cheerios> i think everyone has extended the include path by some means (eg. set_include_path(".../build/classes" . PATH_SEPARATOR . get_include_path());)
11:55 < _cheerios> atleast when i queried about this months ago there was no answer to the contrary
11:56 < selloso> yeah, that's what i thought.. is there a way to do this via an agavi config file?
11:57 < _cheerios> if there is, im not aware
12:00 < selloso> *sigh* It's a pity
12:00 < selloso> many tahnks for you're help
12:01 < selloso> this is a definitely feature wish :-D
12:11 < _cheerios> heh @ restful urls http://www.genwi.com/blogs/order/new/popular/this%20week/filter/type/blog/category/technology/Page211
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14:08 < MikeSeth> http://blog.mikeseth.com/index.php?/archives/4-ActiveRecord-sucks,-but-Kore-Nordmann-is-wrong.html#extended
14:08 < MikeSeth> COMMENTS PLZ
14:22 < kaos|work> too much text *g*
14:23 < kaos|work> (i'll read it later ... only quickly read thru the post of kore 
14:24 < MikeSeth> in summary
14:24 < MikeSeth> MVC model !+ ORM "model"
14:24 < MikeSeth> err
14:24 < MikeSeth> !=
14:24 < kaos|work> yeah
14:24 < kaos|work> that's true indeed ;)
14:26 < MikeSeth> I scold cake/trax/symfony for their railsism :D
14:27 < kaos|work> well, ask 5 people how to do the data storage and you'll get 5 different answers
14:27 < kaos|work> ;)
14:29 < v-dogg> or more
14:30 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: it's the 2 jews principle
14:30 < MikeSeth> "2 jews 3 opinions"
14:30 < kaos|work> heh
14:30 < MikeSeth> but, the question isn't how to do data storage
14:30 < MikeSeth> it's how not to :)
14:31 < kaos|work> well, a model in mvc sense doesn't has anything to do with a db model
14:31 < kaos|work> else stuff like an emailmodel wouldn't make sense *ggg*
14:31 < MikeSeth> rails says it does, and the sheeple repeat
14:32 < MikeSeth> actually this might be a great point to make
14:32 < MikeSeth> a model doesn't necessarily encapsulate database
14:32 < kaos|work> it encapsulates business logic
14:32 < kaos|work> whatever that may be
14:32 < kaos|work> generate reports
14:32 < kaos|work> connect to another server via ssh and do strange things
14:32 < kaos|work> whatever you can imagine ;)
14:33 < MikeSeth> No, I mean, make it a point to show this explicitly
14:34 < kaos|work> omg, i need to sort 5 months of unfiltered spam now 
14:34 < kaos|work> finally back home
14:34 < kaos|work> now with an cool monitor / pc setup ;)
14:35 < kaos|work> 2 tfts, the macbook + synergy + middle monitor can be switched to be secondary monitor for windows
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14:48 < MikeSeth> 2 tfts? you bastard
14:55 < kaos|work> a 20" widescreen
14:56 < kaos|work> and an few years old 17"
14:56 < kaos|work> (without dvi input :D)
15:03 < _cheerios> MikeSeth is blogging? God help us.
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15:04 < MugeSo> huomenta
15:04 < MikeSeth> my imaginary reputation precedes me!
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15:11 < _cheerios> I've been moving forward, now using Doctrine, to having table models (database access) and then plain models (domain logic). I don't have anything against using both to their benefits.
15:12 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: Doctrine is sweeet
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15:20 < foutrelis> :)
15:22 < MugeSo_> I'm about to make MailResponse which sends emails as response/output.
15:22 < MikeSeth> MugeSo_: implemented as a model or a contained action?
15:22 < MikeSeth> foutrelis: oh. I see I've turned you on.
15:22 < MikeSeth> huomenta!
15:23 < MugeSo_> MikeSeth: extends AgaviResponse. and use with contained action.
15:23 < MikeSeth> MugeSo_: ha! Kick ass.
15:23 < MikeSeth> I wanna watch the cakers do that
15:23 < MikeSeth> on the second thought, I dont
15:24 < foutrelis> MikeSeth: You sure did ;)
15:24 < MikeSeth> foutrelis: welcome to the conspiracy
15:24 < MikeSeth> read my ohloh review in the topic for summary of features
15:24 < foutrelis> thanks :)
15:25 < MugeSo_> but I wanna use slots and cache...
15:26 < MikeSeth> MugeSo_: why not? action output is cacheable, and the slot facility is available
15:28 < _cheerios> did you submit your article to places so we can see some angry comments?
15:28 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: you mean the ohloh one or the one I just posted on me blog?
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15:31 < _cheerios> your blog article
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15:38 < MugeSo_> MikeSeth: oh! sorry, I misread what you say.:$
15:40 < MugeSo_> I'm not good at English...
15:41 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: a little bit :)
15:42 < MikeSeth> MugeSo_: nihonjin desu? ;)
15:44 < MugeSo_> MikeSeth: yeah. I'm Japanese.
15:44 < MikeSeth> MugeSo_: awesome
15:45 < MugeSo_> thx
15:46 < MugeSo_> going back to the MailResponse,
15:47 < MikeSeth> have fun
15:52 < MugeSo_> do I have no alternative but to write contained action's Action class or View class like this:
15:52 < MugeSo_>  
15:52 < MugeSo_> Some_OneView extends ProjectBaseView {
15:52 < MugeSo_>     public function execute(AgaviRequestHolder $rd) {
15:52 < MugeSo_>         $response = new MailResponse();
15:52 < MugeSo_>         $this->getContainer()->setResponse($response);
15:52 < MugeSo_>     }
15:52 < MugeSo_> }
15:54 < MugeSo_> I mean ... is this  the only way to change response dinamic.
15:54 < MugeSo_> ?
15:56 < MikeSeth> you can just return it
15:58 < MugeSo_> oh! it's cool!
15:58 < MugeSo_> MikeSeth: thank you!
15:58 < MikeSeth> :D
16:03 < MugeSo_> finaly i can sleep by your favor :)
16:04 < MikeSeth> haha I wish problems like this kept me awake
16:04 < MugeSo_> bye!
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17:57 < _cheerios> \o/
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20:08 < _cheerios> 0 comments :/ aww, that sucks MikeSeth :/
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22:53 < MikeSeth> www.akelos.org
22:53 < MikeSeth> :(
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03:16 < impl> MikeSeth: what's up?
03:19 < impl> MikeSeth: haha, watching the video of that framework
03:19 < impl> looks worthless
03:20 < EoN`> they use "Four spaces, no tabs". 
03:20 < EoN`> which makes it completely void as an option in my books.
03:20 < impl> I use four spaces :(
03:21 < EoN`> i hate spaces :(
03:21 < EoN`> ;)
03:21 < impl> For a framework I'd probably use tabs, though
04:10 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:26 < _cheerios> huomenta
06:37 < _cheerios> Akelos fans in ze logs ;)
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06:39 < MugeSo> huomenta
06:39 < _cheerios> good morning japan!
06:40 < _cheerios> just checked tokyo is 6hrs ahead. oh well, atleast it's morning here ;)
06:41 < MugeSo> oh!! how kind of you to remeber!! :)
06:42 < MugeSo> yeah, it's 15:42.
06:45 < MugeSo> the westering sun is too bright..
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06:48 < MugeSo> why is a rouging instance created in AgaviExecutionFilter?
06:49 < MugeSo> not rouging but routing
06:50 < MugeSo> why not in AgaviExecutionContainer...
06:54 < _cheerios> i havent been looking at agavi sources in eons
06:57 < MugeSo> _cheerios: ok, thanks
06:58 < MugeSo> now, from I've seen, it's impossible to chage routing instance dynamic.
07:02 < v-dogg> why do you want to do that?
07:04 < MugeSo> hmm.
07:05 < v-dogg> if you want to use your own routing, define the class in factories.xml
07:05 < MugeSo> oh! mistake
07:05 < v-dogg> other than that I don't understand why would you want to change it 
07:05 < MugeSo> not routing instance, i mean response instance
07:06 < v-dogg> ok :)
07:10 < MugeSo> and, if it's possible to change "response instance" dynamic, we can use particular respons instance which is , for example, implemented preset header.
07:11 < v-dogg> you can use output_types.xml to configure headers
07:11 < v-dogg> or do it in you BaseView
07:12 < v-dogg> I still fail to see the need to replace the whole instance at runtime
07:12 < MugeSo> i see..
07:12 < MugeSo> in fact, there is anther reason.
07:12 < v-dogg> shoot
07:13 < MugeSo> i'm about to make MailResponse extends AgaviResponse.
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07:14 < v-dogg> hmm... you think that's the best way to handle mailing?
07:15 < v-dogg> why do you want to create a response object for it?
07:15 < v-dogg> what's the use case?
07:15 < MugeSo> yeah,
07:17 < MugeSo> by doing this, we can use features such as slot, caching etc.
07:20 < MugeSo> I plan to use it for sending an email includeing activation key for registration.
07:24 < MugeSo> of course, i know i can make model to do that..
07:28 < _cheerios> when you have a hammer (mvc), everything looks like a nail ;)
07:28 < MugeSo> but i think it's not clear to implement similar function-- slot, caching, rendering, etc -- elsewhere.
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07:32 < MugeSo> hmm....
07:33 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: Akelos fans? in ze logs? where?
07:33 < MikeSeth> seriously I couldn't help but laugh when I read that site
07:33 < MikeSeth> and I don't mean indirection, I mean I actually had a ha-ha
07:35 < MugeSo> _cheerios: you mean i should make model for sending email?
07:36 < MikeSeth> MugeSo: I would. I thought you chose the response for some specific reason.
07:36 < MikeSeth> MugeSo: bear in mind that a model itself can execute contained actions as well
07:40 < MugeSo> MikeSeth: then, I come down to call "$container->getContent() " and send it as email?
07:43 < MikeSeth> MugeSo: yeah. You can use caching that way as well.
07:45 < MugeSo> I see.
07:45 < _cheerios> ah, comments on your article! unsurprisingly someone picked up the DRY part.
07:46 < MugeSo> thx a lot!
07:46 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I find it funny how this is actually a thinly veiled Akelos promotion
07:47 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I thought I'd evaluate it seriously but then I opened the site, and saw the caption that goes "pragmatic" and "productive" and some rounded conrners and screencasts along with exactly one page of documentation that tells you how to set up a sample app
07:47 < MikeSeth> then I laughed
07:47 < _cheerios> actually, afaik, symfony is a fork of mojavi. They copied M3 and added some glue.
07:48 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: funny, their site doesn't mention it
07:48 < _cheerios> eg. from ini->yaml, added propel and some i18n library.
07:48 < MikeSeth> well it does once..
08:13 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
08:24 < codecop> hm, i got 1 field birthdate input, and validating it with xml, i got An exception of type *OverflowException* was thrown when input date is incorrect, how to catch it when validating with xml file
08:24 < codecop> ?
08:25 < codecop> or should i use validation in php file not xml
08:25 < MikeSeth> what do you mean validating with XML? Do you mean using Agavi validators?
08:25 < MikeSeth> codecop: you can use the "check" option of the date validator
08:26 < codecop> ok validators/birthdayInput.xml
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08:28 < codecop> i have in xml file           <parameter name="check">true</parameter>
08:28 < codecop> but  Exception: OverflowException is still here :/
08:30 < MikeSeth> codecop: this might be a bug. Have you updated from SVN recently?
08:31 < codecop> recently no
08:31 < MikeSeth> do that, if the problem doesnt go away, show me 
08:32 < codecop> ok updating
08:32 < codecop> thanx
08:38 < codecop> update isnt resolve, cannot convert the date 197/6/23 into a unix timestamp
08:40 < codecop> if date is bigger 19777/10/11 all ok date is incorrect, but if i  enter year == 197 got exception
08:44 < _cheerios> CouchDB seems interesting http://blog.leetsoft.com/2007/9/2/futuretalk-couchdb (+ love the acronym)
08:46 < codecop> this is xml file that fails to validate date: http://pastebin.ca/679710
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09:00 < MikeSeth> codecop: and the date?
09:00 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: its a JSON filesystem
09:00 < MikeSeth> isn't it?
09:02 < MikeSeth> codecop: what if you do 0197?
09:02 < MikeSeth> codecop: and, yeah, unix timestamps start at 1970
09:02 < MikeSeth> so, it can't be converted down
09:07 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, it's a bit more than that. I could use a distributed, redundant and fault-tolerant storage.
09:08 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: everyone could. The question is, does it perform as advertised
09:09 < _cheerios> it's still in alpha
09:15 < _cheerios> "File storage is coming in the next release. Keep in mind though CouchDb's purpose is not be a "file system" (which has it's own unique set of problems)."
09:15 < _cheerios> w00t, deffo waiting forward for that
09:16 -!- RossC0 [n=lawleyr@80.4.120.163] has joined #agavi
09:16 < RossC0> Huomenta!
09:17 < MikeSeth> hay ross
09:17 < _cheerios> RossC0, MikeSeth is pissing on Rails on his latest blog article. I think you should burn him! ;)
09:17 < MikeSeth> AND all of its descendnats
09:17 < RossC0> URL ? I have 1000's of missed RSS's
09:17 < codecop> MikeSeth, i will look later now have dine
09:17 < codecop> :)
09:17 < RossC0> <3 Merb
09:17 < MikeSeth> RossC0: blog.mikeseth.com
09:17 < RossC0> :D
09:18 < MikeSeth> what happened to agileweb.org?
09:18 -!- codecop [n=codecop@server.senoji.palanga.lm.lt] has quit ["Leaving"]
09:19 < RossC0> ?
09:19 < RossC0> hmm
09:20 < RossC0> i killed something
09:20 < _cheerios> i noticed it was down earlier too. I reckoned RossC0 had gone "underground". ;)
09:20 < _cheerios> (as he wasnt on irc either)
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09:21 < digitarald> heyho, anybody has a sample xml for or-validator
09:21 < digitarald> i have an or validator but it fails if it checks any other child-validator then the first one
09:23 < digitarald> it has 2 child validators, both class equal, first checks if action is username, second checks if action is password. Only username results in success, when i have action=password, it fails and the error is thrown in the equals-username-validator
09:25 < RossC0> 2 tics
09:25 < RossC0> http://pastie.caboo.se/private/ipbxcailz66cxup0od
09:26 < RossC0> my only or validator
09:27 < RossC0> MikeSeth: Like it ActiveRecord sucks :D
09:28 < RossC0> I'm planning to use this once its more stable http://code.google.com/p/ruby-sequel/
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10:20 < RossC0> http://www.dilbert.com/comics/dilbert/archive/dilbert-20070903.html
10:23 < _cheerios> heh heh
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10:32 < MikeSeth> bah
10:32 < MikeSeth> people are inviting me to facebook
10:32 < MikeSeth> i dont want the cia to know who my friends are
10:35 < _cheerios> reading CouchDB it seems so ace. I'm going to be all over it once file storage is implemented.
10:41 < _cheerios> http://jan.prima.de/~jan/plok/archives/72-Some-Context.html
10:43 < _cheerios> time to learn Erlang o_O
10:44 < codecop> can anyone share Date validator.xml to see how get proper dates below unix limiting of 1970 year
10:46 < _cheerios> never used that validator, but remove the cast_to unix?
10:48 < _cheerios> Erlang has no error handling? "If something doesn't work, you just don't care.". Cool. I like it already.
11:05 < RossC0> _cheerios: thanks for the tipoff - I may have a use for that in a personal project :D
11:06  * RossC0 delicious's it :D
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11:15 < MikeSeth> erlang sounds like another bullshit-inspired holy ground to me
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11:18 < _cheerios> i feel a quality blog post in the making!
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11:20 < _cheerios> have you seen comparisons of eg. java vs erlang thread usage when you pump up the load? java goes sky high while erlang is nearly a flatline. i can understand their language of choice for something like this.
11:25 < MikeSeth> I haven't. I don't care about the enterprisey
11:25 < MikeSeth> and now that I've looked towards CouchDB I think it's time to implement something based on it :)
11:27 < _cheerios> agavi + couchdb based forum? atleast it's simple :)
11:31 < MikeSeth> mmp
11:32 < MikeSeth> could be interesting albeit that really is a kind of thing better suited for rdbms
11:33 < MikeSeth> of course any document-based systems with tags and other shit would be a better target
11:33 < MikeSeth> i suppose though I could dick around with it and write a blog
11:33 < _cheerios> why is a forum suited for a rdbms?
11:34 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: the nature of access is very linear
11:37 < _cheerios> you lost me
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11:41 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I mean, the kind of data and queries forums use are best fit for an RDBMS: forums are indeed tabular data
11:44 < _cheerios> what kind of an explanation is that?
11:45 < MikeSeth> *blink*
11:46 < MikeSeth> what do you mean? forums have fixed size, fixed width data. They have a tendency of grouping entries in a predictable manner.
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11:50 < _cheerios> ah, you're wondering how to do similar queries to get the data out?
11:55 < MikeSeth> no, I simply think that a flat database woudl probably be less efficient than a table-based one for this specific kind of application
12:05 < _cheerios> there's probably ways to do these things. we have to give it a spin to find out.
12:07 < MikeSeth> oh my god hahahaha
12:07 < MikeSeth> now people are arguing about which framuhwork is bettar in my blog comments
12:09 < _cheerios> more comments? sweet
12:10 < MikeSeth> i get a distinct feeling that they dont even READ anything other than parts where their favourite framuhwork is getting bashed
12:32 < _cheerios> communication has evolved, MikeSeth. It's all about lolcatz these days. I didn't see any in your blog post.
12:32 < MikeSeth> haha actually now that you say that
12:32 < MikeSeth> I suppose I could put together a bit of educational materials based on lolcats
12:33 < RossC0> hmm agileweb is back up
12:34 < RossC0> but http://agileweb.org doesn't work / redirects to www.agileweb.org
12:34 < RossC0> that a vhost conf issue?
12:34 < _cheerios> webistrano? hmm
12:38 < _cheerios> RossC0, dns record missing for agileweb.org ?
12:39 < _cheerios> ;; QUESTION SECTION:
12:39 < _cheerios> ;agileweb.org.                  IN      A
12:39 < RossC0> was missing I overrode them
12:39 < RossC0> hmm
12:39 < _cheerios> that should be uncommented + point to same as www., and you should be set?
12:40 < MikeSeth> michael@deathwish:~$ dig a agileweb.org @c.ns.bytemark.co.uk +sh
12:40 < MikeSeth> michael@deathwish:~$
12:40 < MikeSeth> indeed
12:40 < MikeSeth> DNS is fubar.
12:41 < RossC0> ah maybe its not fully propegated 
12:41 < RossC0> it got scrubbed yesterday
12:42 < _cheerios> lol @ mike and his hostnames
12:42 < MikeSeth> :D
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13:00 < Whisller> hi
13:03 < MikeSeth> nom nom nom nom
13:20 < MikeSeth> RossC0: any progress on that console implementation?
13:22 < RossC0> erm?
13:22 < MikeSeth> you weren't working on the command line console?
13:22 < RossC0> for ?
13:22 < MikeSeth> for Agavi
13:24 < RossC0> I thought you were doing that ;)
13:25 < RossC0> http://agavi.org/irclogs/agavi-200706.log
13:25 < MikeSeth> aI always wanted to but someone told me theyre working on it
13:25 < MikeSeth> i thought that was you
13:26 < MikeSeth> ahh its Dominik
13:27 < RossC0> ah ok
13:27 < RossC0> still would be cool - specially for better testing
13:28 < RossC0> and for replacing phing
13:28 < MikeSeth> I realized what kinda headache it is..
13:28 < MikeSeth> I'm quite frankly depressed about it
13:31 < RossC0> hmm
13:31 < RossC0> boo
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13:35 < Wombert> mmmh
13:35 < Wombert> 24 inches ftw
13:35 < Wombert> :>
13:38 < MikeSeth> how can you even WALK with that
13:39 < MikeSeth> Wombert: http://blog.mikeseth.com/index.php?/archives/4-ActiveRecord-sucks,-but-Kore-Nordmann-is-wrong.html#comments
13:39 < Wombert> haha MikeSeth 
13:39 < Wombert> good one
13:39 < v-dogg> 24" hanging or during erection?
13:40 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: the word is 'flacid', FYI :)
13:40 < MikeSeth> flaccid, rather
13:40 < v-dogg> haha
13:40 < v-dogg> roger that :)
13:40 < MikeSeth> Wombert: they friggin argue on my blog whose "framework" is better
13:41 < MikeSeth> one of them wrote a framework in 15 lines and another one is cloning Rails in PHP
13:41 < MikeSeth> this blogging thing rapidly becomes a source of amusement
13:41 < MikeSeth> frigging human zoo
13:44 < v-dogg> "First, Symfony has nothing to do with Mojavi. From what I understand it was developed from scratch."
13:44 < RossC0> oops
13:44 < v-dogg> haha, well, you understod wrong
13:44 < Wombert> bahaha
13:45 < Wombert> can you guys hop in there and flame them to dead, plz, kthx? :)
13:49 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: I discovered later that I was wrong. But not /too/ wrong ;)
13:49 < MikeSeth> Wombert: but I'm right about Rails model abuse, am I not
13:49 < Wombert> I haven't read the article yet, MikeSeth 
13:49 < MikeSeth> you should, you would get a chuckle :D
13:51 < v-dogg> Symfony is based on Mojavi and every cool new feature (but not the crappy ones) are ripped from Agavi ;)
13:52 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: IIRC there was once a time when they didnt even bother to change Agavi copyrights
13:53 < v-dogg> oh yes :)
13:54 < nfq> Hey Wombert, got time later to chat?
13:54 < Wombert> nfq: yes, some time later tonight
13:54 < Wombert> that cool?
13:54 < nfq> Totally..
13:54 < Wombert> ace
13:54 < nfq> Perfect in fact.. speak later..
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14:03 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, I read further into couchdb and it does have "tables". They're called Views and are dynamically created/updated based on the criteria you specify.
14:09 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: oh yeah. The question is, how efficient is their indexing
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14:21 < Wombert> couchwhat?
14:22 < MikeSeth> Wombert: ohh you havent heard
14:26 < RossC0> Wombert: tagged it for you in delicious
14:28  * Wombert hugs RossC0 
14:28 < Wombert> restful, json, beh
14:30 < Wombert> uh huh
14:30 < Wombert> ace!
14:30 < Wombert> how quick is that
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14:37 < MikeSeth> we're about to find out
14:37 < MikeSeth> i wonder if erlang is lying
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16:32 < RossC0> hmm delicious is down..
16:34 < RossC0> huzzah its back
16:36 < Wombert> huzzah!
16:38  * _cheerios notes RossC0 is seriously addicted to delicious
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16:43 < RossC0> :D
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17:57 < _cheerios> "Give me all the documents from July where the Potato field is a two-element array where the first element is another JSON object with 7 fields, one of which has the value 24" :slurp:
17:58 < impl> What's a potato field?
18:00 < _cheerios> :)
18:06 < Wombert> _cheerios: pardon?
18:07 < _cheerios> oh, was just marveling a couchdb query :)
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20:13 < JanK_> i think MyPlace is a bad name, because of similiarity to MySpace
20:13 < JanK_> oops
20:15 < nfq> hehe
20:23 < _cheerios> o_O
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20:43 < _cheerios> Your Amazon.com order has shipped \o/
20:44 < _cheerios> ETA 24 days ;)
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21:30 < MikeSeth> what did ya order?
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05:05 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:09 < _cheerios> huomenta!
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07:16 < RossC0> huomenta
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08:33 < _cheerios> anyone been playing with vmware or networking lately?
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09:04 < Wombert> huomenta!
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09:17 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I used to some time ago
09:19 < _cheerios> ok, glad i can pester someone with frustratingly hard questions related to this
09:19 < RossC0> _cheerios: whats up?
09:19 < RossC0> Huomenta Wombert
09:19 < RossC0> :D
09:19 < _cheerios> nothing yet. plan is to install two vmware instances and have them be able to talk with the host + each other.
09:21 < RossC0> well it will just NAT through - so some tweaking of your hosts will make it all go swimmingly
09:21 < RossC0> *should* just NAT through 
09:21 < RossC0> ;)
09:23 < _cheerios> i'll noob it before it goes swimmingly
09:23 < MikeSeth> actually there's quite a bunch of ways to hook it up to your OS
09:24 < MikeSeth> you can literally create a VPN made of virtual machines
09:24 < MikeSeth> I used to do that when I played with trojans, I had a forensic lab and a bunch of virtual test boxes
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10:29 < _cheerios> first vm up. host-guest-host (+net) works fine, now to setup another vm to see about that guest-guest setup...
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10:51 < _cheerios> seems to work out of the box. i hope the internal ip's stay the same for the vm's.
10:55 < RossC0> sweet
11:15 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: they generally do. vmware has its own dhcp daemon
11:15 < _cheerios> lucky me!
11:36 < _cheerios> mmm.. could really use an internal DNS at this point
12:20 < MikeSeth> hosts file <3 ;)
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12:28 < MugeSo> huomenta
12:36 < MugeSo> Wombert:create_function is called in AgaviToolkit::expandDirectives, isn't it?
12:40 < MugeSo> calling me..
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13:20 < _cheerios> gah. a single perl package won't install. :|
13:28 < _cheerios> same package installs fine on the host...
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13:36 < _cheerios> not much use for these vm's if i can't get the sw installed :)
13:40 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: what package?
13:41 < _cheerios> String::CRC32
13:42 < _cheerios> but, it was available via apt-get luckily, so I got past that dependecy
13:44 < _cheerios> still some packages throwing errors, bastards
13:46 < _cheerios> configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables << and i get the oddest errors
13:47 < RossC0> http://www.magentocommerce.com/
13:47 < RossC0> "powered by the zend framework"
13:47 < RossC0> eek
13:48 < MikeSeth> flamework
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13:54 < v-dogg> (muahaha)
13:54 < v-dogg> "framework" 
13:54 < v-dogg> get real...
14:00 < _cheerios> mmm, finally. Anyone use Perl's CPAN? Where does it store the config.log when things go wrong? I couldn't find it in the dir where I issued the perl command atleast.
14:00 < MikeSeth> IIRC in ~/.cpan
14:01 < MugeSo> i've posted a message about create_function to the agavi-dev list.
14:01 < _cheerios> i wonder if on some channel, somwhere, people are dissing our framework just alike
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14:05 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, I checked there earlier and didn't find a thing. It was on the right direction as I tried now again and indeed it was in ~/.cpan/build/<package>/autoconf/config.log
14:09 < RossC0> MugeSo: cool
14:10 < MugeSo> RossC0:about create_function problem?
14:10 < RossC0> yup
14:15 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: heh
14:15 < MugeSo> RossC0:thx
14:16 < MugeSo> but....  now i re-test that..  in truth, not 4864 bytes but 1956bytes per call.
14:20 < MugeSo> there is little in it :p
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15:09 < JamieWolf> Hmmm, when i set a parameter in a renderer class this parameter should be available in the TemplateLayer class, or?
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15:25 < MikeSeth> JamieWolf: you mean as a member of $template?
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15:28 < JamieWolf> MikeSeth, no i mean the AgaviFileTemplateLayer Class
15:29 < JamieWolf> What i was trying to do: I have one Action which should be rendered with smarty. As default I use the AgaviPhpRenderer. So far so good.
15:31 < JamieWolf> I found this post on the mailing list from Wombert an was trying to reproduce it. Which worked. But then I hit a very small Problem, the defaultExtension. With the PhpRenderer it is .php, with SmartyRenderer its .tpl
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15:33 < JamieWolf> by this time i was to lazy to just simply change the extension so i was looking how to set another extension for the SmartyRenderer. Basicly it works with $layer->setParameter('extension', '.php'). So i thought there will be a way to set another default, by doing this in a config file (output_type.xml)
15:36 < JamieWolf> But there ain't. Even if there is some code which should do this in the AgaviOutputType.class.php.
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15:39 < JamieWolf> So now i was trying to add the missing code and make it possible to set a defaultExtension via the output_types.xml but I got stuck at the point where Layer Class checks if it has a Parameter 'extension'
15:40 < JamieWolf> Although I have done setParameter('extension', 'foo') in the AgaviOutputType.class
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20:24 < _cheerios> sami11 19:05 4.9.07 "Voiko C++ jielellä tehdä 3D MMORPG Pelejä???"
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04:39 < MugeSo> where should I check ExecutionContainer parameter, such as is_slot, to set an Action unavailable unless the parameter is set true ?
04:42 < MugeSo> I think either validation or execute
04:52 < MugeSo> or filter?
05:38 < v-dogg> huomenta
05:49 < MugeSo> huomenta
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06:12 < _cheerios> huomenta
06:15 < v-dogg> MugeSo: GMT +3 :)
06:15 < v-dogg> Tokio -6h 
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07:15 < RossC0> huomenta!
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12:38 < MugeSo> huomenta
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15:38 < _cheerios> vm setup <3
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17:32 < shoan> huomenta
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17:56 < shoan> Wombert: where can I get  apache/php5/mysql binary bundle for osx?
17:57 < Wombert_> I use mysql from mysql.com
17:57 < Wombert_> and php from entropy.ch
17:57 < Wombert_> and the apache 1.3 that ships with os x
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17:58 < JanK_> shoan: a simple to set up solution is XAMPP
17:58 < shoan> Wombert: but isn't xampp still beta?
17:59 < JanK_> http://www.apachefriends.org/en/projects.html
17:59 < Wombert> its not really that hard to install the three seperately
17:59 < Wombert> especially not for a programmer :p
17:59 < Wombert> mysql is just a install wizard, and so is php
17:59 < Wombert> apache is installed already
17:59 < Wombert> it's a piece of cake
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18:20 < shoan> downloading the pieces :p
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18:33 < MugeSo> hi
18:34 < MugeSo> Wombert:how do you think about create_function problem which I posted to agavi-dev list.
18:50 < _cheerios> bioshock2 review (damn that's a lot of work for a simple rantin' review) http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/editorials/zeropunctuation/1394-Zero-Punctuation-BioShock
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21:17 < ttj> "Few people understand the psychology of dealing with a highway traffic cop. Your normal speeder will panic and immediately pull over to the side. This is wrong. It arouses contempt in the cop-heart. Make the bastard chase you. He will follow."
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21:27 < trophaeum> ttj no more fear and loathing for you :)
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23:22 < MrJeep> hi
23:22 < MrJeep> is it me or the comparevalidator is somehow messed up ?
23:23 < MrJeep> http://pastie.caboo.se/94417
23:24 < MrJeep> with required set to false, it does not look if one of the arguments equals the other argument when one is filled
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01:41 < shoan> Wombert: still around?
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06:22 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:47 < Whisller> morning :)
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07:17 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
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09:43 < _cheerios> huomenta
09:44 < digitarald> *help* ... validator questions :)
09:46 < _cheerios> RossC0 is touting all caps today. What's hot? ;)
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09:59 < RossC0> digitarald: shoot
09:59 < RossC0> I've got MTools question for you!
09:59 < RossC0> any eclipse users here?
10:00 < RossC0> what php plugin do you use?
10:00 < digitarald> php ide
10:00 < digitarald> from zend
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10:00 < JanK_> digitarald: is it out?
10:01 < digitarald> JanK_ ... u in agavi ... never saw u :D
10:02 < digitarald> http://www.eclipse.org/pdt/index.php
10:02 < JanK_> thats new, because i am about to start a new project, and its likely to be agavi
10:02 < JanK_> so i need do dig into it
10:03 < digitarald> good news, u'll love it ;)
10:03 < digitarald> RossC0: MT question?
10:03 < digitarald> i don't know when i'll release behaviours :D
10:04 < RossC0> man
10:04 < RossC0> go go go!
10:04 < JanK_> but the start is very hard, because i didn't use propel seperately
10:04 < digitarald> JanK_: u don't need to use propel
10:04 < JanK_> i know
10:04 < digitarald> i use doctrine now for example
10:05 < _cheerios> RossC0, switched back to phpeclipse recently as it works with latest eclipse again. PDT is nice, but it (or something) made eclipse totally unusably slow.
10:05 < JanK_> i have to look at doctrine
10:05 < digitarald> doesnt make it slow here
10:05 < digitarald> not slower than eclipse already is ...
10:05 < _cheerios> though i did change my eclipse memory settings recently, could´ve been that. Eclipse needs it or it just doesn't play nice :)
10:05 < RossC0> ok digitarald - in ie6 the sortables is giving me grief - the cloned item doesn't seem to take into account the scroll height and I aint sure why
10:05 < RossC0> _cheerios: I've always found eclipse slow!
10:06 < _cheerios> -vmargs -Xmx512M
10:06 < digitarald> thats the Java feature ;)
10:06 < _cheerios> made all the difference
10:06 < RossC0> digitarald: any obivious ideas on where to start / what could be ze cause?
10:06 < digitarald> zinking
10:08 < digitarald> but sortables do not clone the height/width styles
10:08 < RossC0> well its injecting it in the wrong place
10:08 < digitarald> maybe your css?
10:08 < RossC0> yup me thinking
10:08 < digitarald> zink about zis
10:09 < RossC0> ok I'll create a sandbox version and remove the cruft
10:09 < digitarald> check styles with firebug
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10:40 < nagaozen> moorning!
10:45 < MugeSo> typhoon is approaching...
10:46 < _cheerios> anyone done active/passive mysql setup w/drbd?
10:58 < Wombert> MugeSo: saw your message to the list
10:58 < Wombert> I'll optimize that next week
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10:58 < Wombert> thanks for spotting that
10:58 < MugeSo> Wombert:yeah!
10:58 < Wombert> the primary goal for 1.0 besides documentation is making the framework faster
10:59 < Wombert> and more memory efficient
10:59 < Wombert> we'll start working on that once 0.11 is stable
10:59 < MugeSo> i'm glad to be for help :)
10:59 < Wombert> you're very welcome to contribute to that effort and help find more spots were we can shave off valuable milliseconds and kilobytes ;)
10:59 < Wombert> cool
10:59 < Wombert> digitarald: GOT YOU!
10:59 < Wombert> finally
10:59 < Wombert> about
11:00 < Wombert> er
11:00 < Wombert> squeezebox
11:00 < Wombert> mhm
11:00 < Wombert> query :P
11:02 < RossC0> Wombert: shoot
11:02 < Wombert> eh?
11:02  * RossC0 a squeezebox hax0r
11:02 < Wombert> SO YOU GOT A COPY AND I DIDN'T?????
11:02 < Wombert> ZOMG
11:02 < Wombert> :>
11:02 < Wombert> no in fact I just stole the source code off the site xD
11:02 < Wombert> and I love it
11:02 < Wombert> since I can easily embed flash movies!
11:02  * Wombert hugs squeezebox
11:02  * Wombert hugs digitarald 
11:03 < Wombert> I changed it to run on mootools trunk tho
11:03 < digitarald> u can embed everything :)
11:03 < Wombert> and I have to say
11:03 < Wombert> I don't like mootools anymore
11:03 < Wombert> and I'll move somewhere else
11:03 < digitarald> :,-(
11:03 < digitarald> the reason?
11:03 < Wombert> simple
11:04 < Wombert> I find it unacceptable that 1.2 is not backwards compatible to 1.1
11:04 < digitarald> it will be
11:04 < digitarald> the compat files will be merged in the trunk
11:04 < Wombert> I really don't have the time nor the energy to wade through code (mine and others) and fix things up
11:04 < RossC0> yeah Wombert
11:04 < Wombert> hmm
11:04  * RossC0 pokes Wombert
11:04 < Wombert> yeah but I need to say I don't like the attitude
11:04 < digitarald> ... i'll do it now, so we do not loose u as user
11:04  * Wombert hugs digitarald 
11:05 < Wombert> no need to!
11:05 < digitarald> :P
11:05 < Wombert> I already migrated the code
11:05 < digitarald> thats good, i'll still merge them
11:05 < Wombert> I mean, I should shut up myself, agavi used to be the same, but then, that wasn't labeled stable or 1.x or anything
11:05 < digitarald> since the new downloader is already done
11:05 < Wombert> I talked about this with the guys over in #mootools and I found the attitude pretty weird :/
11:06 < digitarald> since we provide compatibility files, there are no real breaking changes
11:06 < digitarald> just deprecated methods
11:06 < Wombert> because they essentially said "bad luck, but there's gonna be a BC package in case you really want to"
11:06 < Wombert> yeah okay
11:06 < digitarald> its just not included into the downloader
11:06 < digitarald> but that was planned for release
11:07 < digitarald> now 1.2 will be compatible without extra option in the downloader
11:07 < digitarald> to release it faster and make updating easier
11:07 < Wombert> so if I download via svn now it works?
11:07 < digitarald> and mootools always has a weird attitude ... i learned that breaking changes are good during using agavi ;)
11:08 < digitarald> no, i'll ping u when i merged them in
11:08 < Wombert> as I said, no rush
11:08 < Wombert> yeah no doubt and I wouldn't blame them at all otherwise but it's labeled 1.x :/
11:08 < Wombert> and I'm a little afraid that nobody will really look after the BC package and things, you know what I'm saying
11:09 < digitarald> we also change version numbers after 1.2 :P
11:09 < digitarald> bc's where just for dev version
11:09 < digitarald> to encourage devs removing deprecated features
11:10 < digitarald> anyway, its dev, not 1.2 release, thats why it still has bc's. and the plan is that 1.2 is compatible with 1.11. so, we have to write more unit tests for 1.2, then we'll release
11:10 < digitarald> .
11:12 < Wombert> yah
11:12 < Wombert> but I couldn't use 1.1 for some reason
11:12 < Wombert> I think squeezebox didn't work with it or so
11:14 < digitarald> yes ... thats why sb is also not 1.0 ... and now paste your diff ;)
11:14 < digitarald> plugin forge will use agavi ...
11:14 < digitarald> when i have the time to code this simple app
11:14 < Wombert> <:
11:15 < Wombert> trying teh diff but it seems one of them has windows newlines
11:15 < digitarald> ok, just post your code ... i can see what changed
11:15 < Wombert> got it
11:16 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/94558
11:22 < digitarald> ok, nothing big
11:25 < _cheerios> reading german->english via babelfish brings new flavour to documents; "With dmsetup create root100 /etc/dmtab.100 is aroused the RAID0-Array to the life."
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12:53 < Whisller> digitarald: are you there?
12:54 < digitarald> yes
12:54 < Whisller> brb
12:58 < Whisller> Is problem with full mootools package on macos x
12:59 < Whisller> It reduce content of page
13:00 < digitarald> ... full package on mac osx ... reduces content of page?
13:00 < Whisller> mhm
13:01 < Whisller> mootools with whole classes
13:01 < Whisller> It change width of content
13:01 < Whisller> To smaller
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13:05 < digitarald> when u add the script tag for mootools your site gets smaller?
13:06 < Whisller> On first refresh.  I'll try without plugins
13:06 < digitarald> and no other script
13:06 < digitarald> no executed code
13:06 < digitarald> only mootools
13:07 < Whisller> wait
13:07 < Whisller> here is another script
13:07 < Whisller> I'll remove it
13:08 < Whisller> Is better but still small :D
13:08 < Whisller> rotfl
13:09 < Whisller> What is gooing on :/
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13:10 < digitarald> thats not mootools, it does not alter your site or css during load
13:10 < digitarald> nothing happens there
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13:11 < Whisller> hmm
13:11 < Whisller> I must tell them about it :/
13:14 < digitarald> so, so u removed it and it works again?
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13:23 < Whisller> what? I remove they script, and page doesn't has normal size but is bigger than earlier
13:24 < shoan_> are there any work arounds to doing $tablename::doSelect($c) ?
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13:43 < Wombert> shoan: like?
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15:53 < RossC0> how'd I do min_errors for string validation
15:56 < RossC0> well more precisely how'd I set up an error string for both min and max errors
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16:02 < kaos|work> <error for="min">error foo</error>
16:02 < kaos|work> <error for="max">error foo</error>
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16:08 < RossC0> ah for
16:08 < RossC0> thanks kaos|work
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16:25 < JanK_> could someone outline the steps to use another / configere an ORM?
16:30 < _cheerios> 1. choose your orm 2. read its documentation 3. ???
16:32 < JanK_> i mean how would i configure agavi's autoload to load the orm, do i need to change any .xml files? (f.e. factories.xml)
16:36 < _cheerios> add any classes you want agavi to us in autoload, rest is orm dependant
16:37 < Whisller> huh 18:38 I should be in home
16:39 < RossC0> JanK_: there are some classes to help with ORM's
16:39 < RossC0> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/database
16:40 < JanK_> thanks RossC0, i am afk now
16:40 < RossC0> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/381
16:40 < RossC0> nw
16:40 < RossC0> laters all
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17:09 < _cheerios> networking x_X
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17:18 < nfq> hey softdrink
17:18 < nfq> opps, wrong room
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17:21 < JamieWolf> Wombert around?
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17:22 < JamieWolf> I was playing with the layouts and i noticed, that there ain't a way to set a default extension for the templates via the output_types.xml.
17:22 < JamieWolf> the code for it exists in the OT.class
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18:07 < Wombert_> JamieWolf: sure there is!
18:08 < Wombert_> <parameter name="extension">.lolz.php</parameter>
18:08 < Wombert_> give that to a layer
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18:13 < JamieWolf> nope Wombert ain't working
18:13 < JamieWolf> at least not here
18:14 < JamieWolf> wait to the layer...
18:14 < Wombert> yup
18:14 < Wombert> :>
18:14 < JamieWolf> umpf... i set it to the renderer ....
18:16 < JamieWolf> okay there it works. I was confused by the code in AgaviOutpuType.class.php line 155
18:18 < JamieWolf> Wombert thanks anyways
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21:54 < Wombert> zomg
21:54 < Wombert> http://bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=41770
21:54 < Wombert> ...
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22:00  * Wombert pokes impl 
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22:26 < MikeSeth> haha
22:26 < MikeSeth> fail
22:31 < Wombert> you're up late again MikeSeth 
22:31 < MikeSeth> yes. need to order servers :(
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--- Day changed Fri Sep 07 2007
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00:17  * impl pokes Wombert 
00:41 < Wombert> hai
00:41 < Wombert> 1) click teh link above
00:41 < Wombert> 2) read ze text
00:41 < Wombert> 3) come back and say "LOLZ"
00:44 < impl> rofl
00:44 < impl> "iliaa: All you did is make the warning not appear with that commit."
00:44 < impl> sums up PHP so well
00:44 < Wombert> yah
00:44 < Wombert> but
00:44 < Wombert> bed time
00:44 < Wombert> nn
00:44 < impl> Night
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07:56 < _cheerios> huomenta
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08:11 < Whisller> morning
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08:16 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
08:16 < _cheerios> RossC0 in BATTLE mode again :)
08:16 < RossC0> just waking ya'll up!
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09:30 < _cheerios> when a PREROUTING rule is applied on iptables, how can I list it (only input,forward,output chains get listed on iptables -L)?
09:31 < _cheerios> ah, it was part of a table and needed more cmds
09:41  * Wombert pokes trophaeum 
09:41 < Wombert> you there?
10:12 < trophaeum> Wombert, yo
10:12 < trophaeum> sup
10:12 < Wombert> an approach for memcache group storage
10:12 < Wombert> instead of having one map for each level
10:12 < Wombert> you could simply assign numbers to group combinations
10:12 < Wombert> and then to flush a group
10:12 < Wombert> you increase the number
10:13 < Wombert> I mean... you don't really have to delete the data, you know
10:13 < Wombert> it's gonna be purged eventually anyway
10:13 < Wombert> so you'd have like products0
10:13 < Wombert> on a flush() the next number is 1
10:13 < Wombert> and so on
10:13 < trophaeum> Wombert, im planning to implement something like this for xcache this weekend
10:14 < Wombert> the only question is where to store the number thing
10:14 < Wombert> could store it in memcache too, give it high prio/ttl and if it's not there, flush the whole cache or so
10:14 < Wombert> that woud make it pretty failsafe
10:15 < trophaeum> sec, phone
10:25 < trophaeum> ok, bak, now to read what u were saying
10:26 < trophaeum> ok, explain that better, wha?
10:30 < trophaeum> Wombert, *ping*
10:34 < Wombert> eh?
10:34 < Wombert> well I'm not entirely sure how to make it work for nested groups
10:34 < Wombert> but
10:34 < Wombert> lets say you have a group "products", right?
10:34 < trophaeum> ya
10:34 < Wombert> and one for the product it
10:35 < Wombert> then your key is not products_12345
10:35 < Wombert> where 12345 is the id
10:35 < Wombert> instead, you start out with a zero
10:35 < Wombert> and store in products0_12345
10:35 < Wombert> now if you want to "flush" all products
10:35 < Wombert> you simply increase that number
10:35 < Wombert> and store into products1_12345 from now
10:35 < Wombert> memcache will eventually throw all the unused products0 keys out of the cache
10:36 < trophaeum> then products is the current key (0 or 1) that your upto?
10:36 < trophaeum> interesting
10:36 < Wombert> such an approach would take advantage of this specific behavior of memcache - it gets rid of unused value sover time
10:37 < trophaeum> hmmmmm, can we set the products key to never expire though or be a higher priority than the rest and to expire 'last'? (i forget memcache, i use xcache mostly these days)
10:37 < Wombert> yes, that was what I meant earlier
10:38 < trophaeum> i like this concept :)
10:38 < Wombert> actually, it is not much of a big deal to store it in the memache as well
10:38 < Wombert> because if it gets purged
10:38 < Wombert> then all that happens is your stuff is lost
10:38 < Wombert> well of course you'd have to add logic for that
10:38 < trophaeum> yup, i can see where your going
10:38 < Wombert> i.e. if you grab the current number and you don't get something back, flush the entire cache or so
10:39 < Wombert> and right now I really can't see how it would work nicely with a depth of more than two groups
10:39 < Wombert> do you?
10:39 < trophaeum> im looking at this for a site for work that is estimated to get 50k users (social networkingish) and we need something to store data as we are looking at nearly 10 queries per user profile page
10:39 < trophaeum> if you limit to 1k items per array... i still wonder how fast it would be
10:40 < Wombert> can't you just use agavis cachng or so?
10:40 < Wombert> (if you use agavi)
10:40 < trophaeum> this project is really crappy non mvc + smarty + propel
10:40 < trophaeum> i bitched to get mvc and got ignored
10:41 < trophaeum> (at that stage it wouldv been zend... it wouldv been better than what we have now though!)
10:42 < trophaeum> i might try implementing both over the weekend
10:42 < trophaeum> see what happens
10:42 < trophaeum> i wonder if xcache gives out of memory or flushes the soonest to expire when its mem cache runs full
10:42 < Wombert> it should flush old/unused values
10:43 < trophaeum> should doesnt mean does :/
10:43 < Wombert> mkay let me rephrase that
10:43 < Wombert> I have absolutely no idea :p
10:43 < Wombert> better? ;)
10:43 < trophaeum> ;)
10:44 < trophaeum> not documented
10:44 < trophaeum> @#%
10:45 < trophaeum> ok, consider this on my weekend todo list
10:46 < Wombert> When the table is full, subsequent inserts cause older data to be purged in least recently used (LRU) order.
10:46 < Wombert> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memcached
10:46 < trophaeum> im probably spending time over the weekend optimizing a 1.3m hit/mo site too so thisll come into play with that
10:46 < trophaeum> thats memcache, i need xcache info too
10:47 < trophaeum> nothing against memcache but xcache is easier to use on works server
10:47 < trophaeum> so we use that
10:47 < Wombert> xcache is local shared mem
10:47 < Wombert> which means its absolutely useless in a load balanced environment
10:47 < trophaeum> though i have an accelcache class with static methods that has an xcache, memcached, apc, eaccel backend autoselector etc in it
10:47 < trophaeum> haha, im not dealing with load balanced
10:47 < trophaeum> that said, memcached to be optimal, there needs to be a local and remote cache
10:48 < trophaeum> so in an optimal memcache setup you would use xcache for most common and then memcache when it isnt in local xcache
10:48 < trophaeum> why hit the network when you could have some REALLY common data local
10:49 < trophaeum> set sets on both local and remote, get checks local first, remote if it cant find it, local has a low ttl, something along these lines
10:49 < Wombert> HARR!
10:49 < Wombert> dude!
10:49 < Wombert> duuude!
10:49 < trophaeum> lol, dude wheres my car?
10:50 < Wombert> better than just 1,2,3,4,5
10:50 < trophaeum> (im in the process of getn drunk, got a tax cheque for 0$ instead of lotsa$ today)
10:50 < Wombert> make a random number
10:50 < Wombert> and store that number in products_key
10:50 < trophaeum> your right, random is a lot better
10:50 < Wombert> do cler all products
10:50 < Wombert> just remove products_key!
10:50 < Wombert> it's not there anymore, so you generate a new rand number
10:50 < Wombert> tadaa
10:50 < Wombert> :>
10:50 < trophaeum> lol
10:50 < trophaeum> NEED TO TEST XCACHE! :P
10:51 < trophaeum> and i really dont want to change from xcache to apc on works server
10:51 < trophaeum> 2 weeks and cpanel will have apache2... *waits impatiently*
11:13 < trophaeum> Wombert, can i ping u tomorow (well, in about 12-14hrs) about agavi stuff?
11:14 < trophaeum> assuming i dont have a hangover
11:17 < Wombert> mmmmh
11:17 < Wombert> no
11:17 < Wombert> I'm driving home to munich (for good!) in 24 hrs
11:17 < Wombert> I don't think I'll still be up in 12hrs
11:17 < Wombert> but you can try, of course
12:04 < trophaeum> so when u online next that i can bug u? or u getn a good week's worth of sleep? ;) (im drunk now so ignore me if u so desire)
12:19 < Wombert> lawl
12:19 < Wombert> of course you can bug me
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15:15 < MrJeep> quick one, how can I set headers in the view ?
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15:16 < MrJeep> this->getresponse()->setParameter('http_headers'.... ?
15:16 < MrJeep> like content type
15:16 < MrJeep> and attachment file
15:17 < Wombert> $this->getResponse()->setHttpHeader('Content-Type', 'text/foo'); ?
15:26 < MrJeep> thnx once again wombert
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15:48 < _cheerios> i am the world's slowest sysadmin for shure. hours & hours of tinkering!
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16:34 < RossC0> have a good one!
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18:33 < _cheerios> *puuh*
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21:02  * Wombert_ pokes impl 
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21:03 < nfq> Hey Wombert, got a chance to chat later?
21:03 < Wombert> nfq: how much later is later? :)
21:03 < Wombert> how about in fifteen minutes or so?
21:03 < nfq> anytime really! Otherwise tomorrow
21:03 < nfq> sure..
21:03 < Wombert> I'll ping you
21:03 < Wombert> impl: read today's logs, from 9:41
21:04 < nfq> cheers
21:04 < Wombert> till 12:19
21:52 < _cheerios> HA! THAT'S NOTHING! THE GUY IN INDIA NEVER SLEEPS! NEVER!
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22:24 < impl> damn, Wombert is a genius :P
--- Day changed Sat Sep 08 2007
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06:17 < JanK_> hi
06:18 < JanK_> there is a difference in the output_types.xml of the sample app and the application stub generated by 'agavi project'
06:21 < JanK_> in one file the path is //layout/layer and in the other //layout/layers/layer
06:22 < JanK_> the same goes for parameters
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06:43 < _cheerios> huomenta!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
06:56 < _cheerios> all ze germans sleeping!
07:07 < JanK_> _cheerios: not me :P
07:09 < _cheerios> how do I say "I need the IP for High-Availability purposes to support my business" ?
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08:12 < JanK_> _cheerios: sorry i didn't notice your response. in german? "Ich brauche die IP fuer Hochverfuegbarkeitszwecke in meiner Firma [company] / fuer meinen Beruf [job/profession]"
08:18 < _cheerios> thanks!
08:18  * _cheerios slaps kaos|work with a tr0ut
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08:28 < _cheerios> "I'm supporting the parent here. The ego's associated to our IT department were astronomic. They actually believed that they can never be fired because they were the only ones who know the 'guts' of our infrastructure. You should have seen them drop a load in their shorts when we had the whole IT infrastructure review by a third party. They pointed out the security risks that hadn't been noticed, the short-falls, the poor implementation (from a
08:28 < _cheerios>  business perspective) and more importantly the fact that 25% time was being wasted by IT on IT 'pet' projects that had no sign-off from management. We fired the whole department except for a temp and hired him full-time because he actually worked efficiently and restocked (out-sourcing during the re-hire process). Now we have a more secure system and an IT group who are actually responsive to the IT needs of the company, rather than pretendedi
08:28 < _cheerios> ng that the IT position was a personal hobby. What a bunch of arrogant, egotistical, slackers we had." <<  :D
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10:48 < _cheerios> what are the [*:*] numbers in iptables rules?
10:50 < _cheerios> ahh, "The numbers in square brackets are packet:byte counters. They are saved by iptables when your system shuts down, and restored when it boots up. Assuming no crashes, you can use this to keep a byte count if your ISP has a monthly traffic quota."
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11:55 < JanK_> does anybody use Doctrine with Agavi?
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12:16 < _cheerios> a little
12:18 < JanK_> _cheerios: do you use this class for doctrine? http://trac.agavi.org/attachment/ticket/381/BaseDoctrineDatabase.class.php
12:19 < _cheerios> i've tried it, yes
12:19 < JanK_> or wait, i should better ask first, if you are willing to help me setting up doctrine for agavi
12:23 < JanK_> _cheerios: do you have the time to help me?
12:23 < _cheerios> it works just as any other agavi db connector
12:24 < JanK_> i am new to agavi so i dont have any experiences
12:24 < JanK_> let me summerize what i did so far
12:25 < JanK_> in settings.xml: use_database set to true
12:26 < _cheerios> database support on in settings.xml, in databases.xml add an entry with <parameter name="dsn">mysql://user:pass@localhost/DB</parameter> and then add that BDM.class.php to autoload.xml, and you should be set.
12:28 < JanK_> this should be fine for a root with no password? mysql://root:@localhost/test
12:28 < _cheerios> always set passwords
12:29 < JanK_> ok, i'll create a user with password
12:35 < JanK_> i always get a Doctrine_Connection_Exception no matter what i set up in the dsn
12:39 < _cheerios> read up your mysql logs for errors
13:02 < JanK_> _cheerios: ok, i found the mistake, agavi didnt connect to the database
13:03 < JanK_> i needed this: $this->getContext()->getDatabaseConnection()->connect();
13:03 < JanK_> shoudnt it connect automatically?
13:03 < _cheerios> what were you using before that?
13:03 < JanK_> just: $myPost = $this->getContext()->getModel('Post');
13:03 < JanK_> i added the connect line above that one and it works
13:04 < _cheerios> loading a model is just loading a model
13:05 < JanK_> sure, but i thought agavi would lazy connect to the db
13:05 < _cheerios> you get a db handle with $db = $this->getContext()->getDatabaseConnection('name');
13:06 < _cheerios> which can then be used like $db->query() or whatever is being used
13:06 < JanK_> yeah, but i want to use doctrine
13:07 < _cheerios> you have your db connection now, so just use doctrine syntax
13:07 < JanK_> i didnt save the db handle
13:08 < JanK_> just: $this->getContext()->getDatabaseConnection()->connect();
13:08 < JanK_> and then: $myPost = $this->getContext()->getModel('Post');
13:09 < JanK_> so my question is, if getModel retrieves the default DB connection isn't it supposed to connect if there is no existing connectin?
13:10 < _cheerios> getModel doesn't do anything relating to the DB unless you make it do it
13:12 < _cheerios> using that BaseDoctrineModel you have Doctrine_Manager instance. You load models thru that to keep the db connection, or if you want to use getModel, then do your own logic there.
13:15 < _cheerios> argh :| nfs borked. mystic errors. :|
13:24 < JanK_> _cheerios: thank you, now i dont use getModel and it works perfectly with just new FooModel();
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14:52 < _cheerios> anyone know dns hosts that have an api to change the records?
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18:18 < Wombert> reeeeee
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--- Day changed Sun Sep 09 2007
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00:50 < impl> Heyo Wombert 
00:50 < Wombert> hai
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00:52 < impl> Read the logs yesterday, I like the idea
00:52 < impl> I've been trying to figure out if there's an easy way to do multiple layers of grouping
00:53 < Wombert> and? :)
00:54 < impl> let's see... if we clear products, that would get a new products_key
00:54 < impl> so...
00:54 < impl> Hmm, this is surprisingly hard to think about and describe :P
00:55 < Wombert> there is no way, or is there
00:55 < impl> products_0_key
00:55 < impl> er
00:55 < impl> no
00:55 < impl> it would have to be like parent_0_child_key
00:56 < Wombert> yes
00:56 < Wombert> well
00:56 < Wombert> lets call it "key" for that, mh, random number
00:56 < Wombert> so er
00:56 < Wombert> products_<key>_<product_id>
00:56 < impl> right...
00:56 < Wombert> to flush all products, generate a new key, which is global to all products cached
00:56 < Wombert> now let us throw in a locale
00:57 < Wombert> products_<key>_<product_id>_<locale> is not gonna cut it
00:57 < Wombert> since we cannot remove all locale variants for a specific product (represented by an id)
00:57 < impl> it would have to be locale_<key>_<locale>_products_<key>_<product_id>
00:57 < impl> and we'd have to check both keys
00:58 < Wombert> that key, however, would
00:58 < Wombert> err
00:58  * Wombert blinks
00:58 < impl> Right?
00:58 < Wombert> I have no idea man
00:58 < Wombert> oO
00:58 < impl> okay
00:59 < impl> let's say you have locale_key = 1
00:59 < Wombert> wwwwait
00:59 < Wombert> a locale key would be unique _per_ product!
00:59 < Wombert> right?
00:59 < impl> no... why?
00:59 < Wombert> that's the problem
00:59 < impl> er, maybe I have this backwards then
00:59 < impl> Yeah
00:59 < impl> alright
01:00 < Wombert> because you only want to flush all locale variants for a specific produt
01:00 < Wombert> not all of them
01:00 < impl> well let's reverse the example then
01:00 < Wombert> think of the normal folder structure
01:00 < impl> products_<key>_<product_id>_locale_<key>_<locale>
01:00 < Wombert> products/81236/de/cache.dat, products/81236/en/cache.dat etc
01:00 < impl> yah, okay
01:00 < Wombert> rm -rf products/81236 to flush the cache for that prod
01:01 < Wombert> okay and then we would store that locale key in products_<key>_<product_id>_locale
01:01 < Wombert> right?
01:01 < impl> sure
01:01  * Wombert ponders
01:01 < Wombert> and remove that to flush em all
01:01 < Wombert> brilliant!
01:01  * Wombert hugs impl 
01:01 < impl> :D
01:02 < Wombert> you still need to make multiple calls to the memcache
01:02 < Wombert> one for each group you have so you get the keys
01:02 < impl> Yeah
01:02 < impl> Overhead was my concern initially
01:03 < Wombert> well its far less overhead than storing a map for each group level :D
01:03 < Wombert> I wonder if trophaeum_ already had a shot at implementing this
01:03 < Wombert> btw
01:03 < impl> provided people don't start running out of memory
01:03 < Wombert> do you know if php tells the web server "I'm done" before shutdown funcs are reached?
01:04 < impl> I'm pretty sure you can still print stuff out, so I imagine it's still running in the context of the Web request
01:04 < Wombert> I always thought you couldn't
01:04 < Wombert> hmm
01:04 < Wombert> because
01:04 < Wombert> lets say you use memcache for the session...
01:04 < Wombert> not good
01:04 < Wombert> been there, done that, and it won't work reliably
01:04 < Wombert> so you need to write to a database as well
01:05 < trophaeum_> i hear my name :)
01:05 < trophaeum_> u mean the caching stuff?
01:05 < impl> Really?
01:05 < Wombert> but if you write on each request and the web server waits for that to finish, the benefit is gone
01:05 < Wombert> yes, and it's what the memcache guys recommend as well
01:05 < impl> hmmh, I always figured that would work
01:05  * impl slaps PHP
01:05 < Wombert> well
01:05 < impl> trophaeum_: yeah
01:06 < Wombert> trophaeum_: I think we got it figured out for nested groups
01:06 < Wombert> Since PHP 4.1, the shutdown functions are called as the part of the request so that it's possible to send the output from them.
01:06 < Wombert> beh
01:06 < trophaeum_> Wombert, oh?
01:06 < Wombert> maybe if we send a content length and Conneciton:close or so?
01:07 < Wombert> but apache is still gonna listen for new data
01:07 < Wombert> beeeh
01:08 < impl> o_O
01:18 < trophaeum_> so whats the go with nested groups? is it the same as what u were talking about last night wiht me or ?
01:18 < impl> pretty much, just scroll up a screen or two
01:20 < trophaeum_> so products_<key>_<product_id>_locale_<key>_<locale>... 1st key is mt_rand(), 2nd key is? locale is just en de etc?
01:21 < trophaeum_> and then are we using this to flush all caches at once or that locale only? or are we doing it so we can do either?
01:21 < impl> second key is also random
01:22 < impl> stored in products_<key>_<product_id>_locale
01:22 < trophaeum_> 2nd key is mt_rand but != 1st key? an array in that key that has locale->current rand id?
01:22 < trophaeum_> or do we do <locale> and put a single number in there?
01:22 < impl> Huh? :p
01:22 < impl> The locale key is in products_<key>_<product_key>_locale
01:23 < trophaeum_> locale is replaced by en de etc or is a key named locale with an array stored in it?
01:23 < impl> then you use that key for products_<product_key>_<product_id>_locale_<locale_key>_<locale_name>
01:23 < trophaeum_> ok, so an array
01:23 < impl> for example, products_1_26923_locale_2_en
01:23 < impl> actually
01:24 < impl> Wombert: What's the benefit of using random numbers?
01:24 < impl> then we risk a collision
01:24 < trophaeum_> not that likely, incrementing we're more likely to hit it
01:24 < trophaeum_> what about mt_rand on no number then increment in future
01:24 < trophaeum_> cos we lose that if we run out of memory
01:25 < impl> Oh, you mean if the key disappears and then we regenerate it, we're more likely to hit it
01:25 < trophaeum_> bingo
01:25 < impl> hmm
01:25 < impl> this is true
01:25 < trophaeum_> if we mt_rand though then increment in future, thats safer
01:25 < impl> Yeah
01:26 < trophaeum_> we could always leave a products_<key>_used = true in the cache store incase we're lucky enough that its still left?
01:28 < trophaeum_> wow soy milk in coffee... odd
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01:32 < trophaeum_> stupid rat walking on my keyboard
01:32 < impl> Pet?
01:32 < trophaeum_> yup
01:32 < impl> lawl
01:33 < trophaeum_> 3 of em, 1 on the desk atm though
01:36 < trophaeum_> ok, i think i know how im going to code this up
01:36 < trophaeum_> guess i need to install memcache again though :)
01:36 < trophaeum_> iv just used xcache for so long now instead
01:50 < trophaeum_> so Wombert, you using propel in your new toy youv been going without sleep on?
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01:54 < trophaeum_> goin to see simpsons movie, ill code this up when i get back (for xcache, memcache and maybe a filesystem based version too)
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06:14 < v-dogg> huomenta
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11:09 < _cheerios> huomenta
11:10 < MikeSeth> huomenta
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11:12 < Wombert> hai
11:26 < MikeSeth> Flex is interesting
11:27 < shoan> MikeSeth: what do you need on the serverside to run flex?
11:28 < MikeSeth> shoan: nothing. 
11:28 < MikeSeth> shoan: Flex is basically an ActionScript framework and a mxml => AS compiler that produces .swf files
11:28 < shoan> which documentation/tutorial are you looking at?
11:29 < MikeSeth> shoan: Adobe's LiveDocs and the ``explorer'' example in the SDK
11:29 < MikeSeth> I havent yet looked at data models/bindings but it seems it has high level mechanisms to populate forms and submit requests
11:30 < shoan> ok
11:30 < MikeSeth> I wish I could use XUL, but it's just too poor 
11:34 < shoan> why?
11:36 < _cheerios> does stuff related to Flex still cost $$ (the server part?)
11:37 < _cheerios> i remember looking into it 1-2 years back and it was enterpriseish like $5000 or so
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15:09 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: no
15:09 < MikeSeth> shoan: XUL doesnt have a standard way to populate control elements. The closest it has is RDF data bindings, which are a terrible thing to work with
15:13 < shoan> eeeks
15:20 < MikeSeth> or you could populate them with custom js.. and I'd rather not
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15:49 < CIA-11> dominik * r2069 /branches/0.11/src/storage/AgaviPdoSessionStorage.class.php: 
15:49 < CIA-11> make time formatting configurable
15:49 < CIA-11> closes #569
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16:58 < _cheerios> how do i add case-insensitivity for a routing rule? like "^/blah/i" (where /i is the c-i modifier)?
17:05 < _cheerios> kaos|work, Wombert_, some other regex guru with agavi mindset around?
17:06 < kaos|work> you don't
17:06 < kaos|work> read up in the manpage how to set options for a subpattern
17:06 < kaos|work> that should work
17:07 < Wombert_> (?i)LoLz should do the job
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17:08 < _cheerios> i did (place:x|X) and <default for="place">x</default>, for now
17:08 < Wombert> (place:(?i)x)
17:09 < _cheerios> even better
17:09 < Wombert> the modifier is only valid inside the subpattern, mind you
17:09 < _cheerios> just needed a capital first letter for the Url to work too
17:10 < Wombert> well then you're probably better of with (place:[Xx]yzabc)
17:11 < _cheerios> even even better, one less character
17:11 < _cheerios> thanks guys
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17:38 < _cheerios> o_O evil reconnect magic
17:42 < CIA-11> david * r2070 /branches/0.11/src/storage/ (3 files): 
17:42 < CIA-11> Reverts [2069] and re-implements this functionality in a more generic fashion
17:42 < CIA-11> and for all other implementations where this is theoretically possible. Also
17:42 < CIA-11> fixes a GC bug with pgsql. Closes #569 (again) and #570. Use param "date_format"
17:42 < CIA-11> and a valid date() format string, defaults to "U" for a normal unix timestamp.
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18:15 < _cheerios> Sheep Invade Madrid http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/6986222.stm 
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20:09 < CIA-11> david * r2071 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: synced changelog
20:09 < Wombert> I think it's getting time for a release there
20:09 < ttj> RC6?
20:10 < Wombert> yes
20:12 < impl> hmms
20:18 < v-dogg> RC Party!
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23:34 < Wombert> harr
23:34 < Wombert> so
23:35 < Wombert> send a Content-Length
23:35 < Wombert> and
23:35 < Wombert> Connection: Close
23:35 < Wombert> and then a shutdown function will not cause teh browser to wait for output
23:35 < Wombert> which means you can do slow operations there
23:35 < Wombert> like writing sessions to a db as a backup for memcache
23:35 < impl> hah, really? Cool
23:36 < Wombert> (and agavi uses shutdown funcs for, well, shutting down things, and session_write_close() is called in Storage::shutdown)
23:36 < Wombert> yes, very
23:36 < Wombert> so just do
23:36 < impl> this easy to put into WebResponse?
23:36 < Wombert> hehe
23:36 < Wombert> <parameter name="Connection">Close</parameter> in the http_headers param to your output type
23:36 < Wombert> and that's it ;)
23:36 < impl> Oh
23:36 < impl> well that works
23:36 < impl> hah
23:36 < impl> :P
23:37 < Wombert> it's not entirely optimal
23:37 < Wombert> I think we need a list of things to redo for 2.0
23:37 < Wombert> one of them is transports vs flavors
23:37 < Wombert> for both request and response
23:37 < Wombert> oh and I think we should start working on a storage thing for 1.0, impl 
23:37 < Wombert> we could have a storage_manager
23:38 < Wombert> with a default storage
23:38 < Wombert> which context:.getStorage() grabs
23:38 < impl> So we avoid the BC problem there?
23:38 < Wombert> you know, like getDatabaseConnection
23:38 < Wombert> yes, I think that would avoid it
23:38 < Wombert> well
23:38 < impl> although I have a problem with defining a default storage
23:38 < Wombert> the storage would still have session specific stuff in it, not sure if that is good, but...
23:38 < Wombert> well but we need that to maintain bc
23:38 < impl> yeah, that's the thing
23:39 < impl> sessions and caching would both be under the same system
23:39 < Wombert> also, if you don't have <storage_manager> but just <storage> in your factories.xml it implicitly creates a manager with just that one storage for you
23:39 < Wombert> and the session would use the default storage, or so
23:39 < impl> mmm, hacky
23:39 < Wombert> :<
23:39 < Wombert> or we create a new subsystem "cache"
23:39 < Wombert> I want it to be available and usable in userland
23:40 < impl> We can mark getStorage() deprecated
23:40 < Wombert> so you can quickly store and retrieve values to/from a specific storage thing
23:40 < impl> There needs to be storage contexts, though, I think
23:40 < impl> you could have multiple caches and multiple session storages
23:40 < impl> although I don't know why for the latter
23:41 < Wombert> well
23:41 < Wombert> heh
23:41 < Wombert> write to memcache first, then to database
23:41 < Wombert> always write to both
23:41 < Wombert> but read from memcache first and if no data is found, then from database
23:41 < Wombert> or so
23:41 < Wombert> but that's more advanced
23:41 < Wombert> the question if we can make that fit into 1.0 without it being hacky
23:41 < Wombert> but I really want such a functionality; being able to cache actions to memcache would be ace
23:41 < impl> well I had started writing some StorageManager stuff
23:41 < Wombert> especially with the thing we worked out yesterday
23:42 < Wombert> well that's trivial ain't it
23:42 < impl> er, nevermind, it was just caching stuff I was working on
23:42 < impl> it is trivial, would almost be a clone of DatabaseManager :p
23:42 < impl> as I noted on the wiki
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06:33 < _cheerios> huomenta!
06:35 < ttj> Wow, first lecture today.
06:38 < _cheerios> is the lecturer Koivuniemen Herra?
06:40 < _cheerios> kernel hackers group photo @ http://lwn.net/Articles/248891/
06:47 < ttj> Nope. New Venture Development I, Mr. Kelly.
07:05 < _cheerios> Is there a way to apply/inject routing rules? Say, for a subdomain, I have a route name="forum" that consists of 30 routes. Now I want that same route to work under the name of "bbs" (but only for this subdomain, not affecting the root domain), without manually tinkering with routing.xml. How do I accomplish this? Is there a way to populate, and load routing.xml for any number of subdomains? Something like <route name="app" pattern="^(subdomain
07:05 < _cheerios> :[a-zA-Z0-9_]+).service.com" module="Domain" action="Load"> (include subdomain's routing settings from another cached .xml) </route>
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07:22 < RossC0> huomenta!
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10:32 < RossC0> heh all anybody do rss routes that require authenication?
10:32 < RossC0> if so how best to tackle that?
10:38 < Wombert> well
10:38 < Wombert> usually, you have two options
10:38 < Wombert> a) http auth
10:38 < Wombert> b) a hash in the url
10:39 < Wombert> you can implement a) in User::startup(), I guess
10:44 < RossC0> hmm ok
10:44  * RossC0 looks up http auth
10:45 < _cheerios> Wombert, any insight into my subdomain routing setup problem?
10:46 < Wombert> ?
10:47 < _cheerios> in ze logs
10:50 < RossC0> _cheerios: <xinclude ?
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10:52 < shoan> whats the latest on the agavi.org website?
10:55 < _cheerios> can the xinclude get the matched subdomain from the routing rule?
11:01 < _cheerios> <route name="app" pattern="^(userdomain:[^.]+).myservice.com$"><xi:include src="/routes/{how-to-get-userdomain-variable-here?}.xml" /> </route>
11:02 < RossC0> ah ok
11:02 < RossC0> Wombert / kaos|work can you match sudomains in routing ?
11:02 < Wombert> yes, sure
11:03 < Wombert> <route pattern="^(username:[^.]+).myservice.com$" source="_SERVER[HTTP_HOST]" callback="UserSubdomainCallback" />
11:03 < Wombert> the callback in onMatched could verify if the subdomain existed
11:04 < Wombert> also you could give the route a name and an onGenerate
11:05 < Wombert> which then modifies the options ("authority") so the subdomain is generated correctly
11:09 < shoan> anybody using doctrine?
11:10 < _cheerios> mmm, can the xi:include be passed a variable at all then? no?
11:10 < _cheerios> shoan, a little
11:11 < shoan> _cheerios: how do you use doctrine with an existing database? Do all the classes need to be hand coded or is there a build process?
11:11 < _cheerios> another problem arises with the gen() immediately there, unless name="app" is removed, for routes to work same. oh the humanity :|
11:11 < _cheerios> doctrine docs have a portion on importing a db
11:20 < MikeSeth> Haha, looks like I've sold Doctrine to everyone here :D
11:21 < MikeSeth> RossC0: I do what you're looking for with HTTP auth. 
11:24 < RossC0> MikeSeth: cool
11:24 < RossC0> got any example code
11:24 < RossC0> MikeSeth - I think it was my doctrine class then you're shouting about it that sold it!
11:25  * RossC0 steals some credit :)
11:34 < shoan> MikeSeth: I can't import from an existing database. let me pastebin the code
11:34 < shoan> MikeSeth: http://pastebin.com/m3711d8c4
11:35 < shoan> I don't get an error
11:35 < shoan> but neither do I get dir called myrecords
11:42 < _cheerios> there's always errors.
11:42 < RossC0> shoan: might be better to ask on #doctrine
11:42 < shoan> ok
11:43 < RossC0> might be quicker ;)
11:44 < Wombert> _cheerios: xincludes are resolved at compile time!?
11:45 < Wombert> _cheerios: overwrite gen() to append "app" when necessary (whatever the rules for that may be)
11:45 < Wombert> or set it to imply="true" so it's always generated
11:45 < _cheerios> that sucks for xi:include :(
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11:46 < _cheerios> any other ideas to load routing rules dynamically based on the subdomain?
11:53 < Wombert> plenty
11:53 < Wombert> one app per subdomain
11:53 < Wombert> one context per subdomain
11:53 < Wombert> overwrite the route loading
11:53 < Wombert> etc
11:53 < Wombert> but it's nothing trivial
11:59 < _cheerios> initialize() in routing; $cfg = AgaviConfig::get("core.config_dir") . "/routing.xml"; being able to specify the routing.xml could be a quick hack. Instead load /(customRouting).xml
12:01 < _cheerios> if(subdomain){AgaviConfig::set("core.use_custom_route",'route/666'); }. i'll look into it when i implement it.
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12:13 < Wombert> _cheerios: yup
12:13 < Wombert> should I move the config loading to a dedicated funciton for you?
12:13 < Wombert> so you only have to overwrite that one
12:13 < Wombert> 'cause I assume you want to overwrite webrouting, and that's gonna be difficult this way ;)
12:16 < _cheerios> I'm not going to implement it right now, we can let it brew a while longer. Basically I want to serve the same application, say our sample app would be Mac OS X. And each user would have their subdomain. And the users are bastards and each want their own routes for their Mac experience. That's what I'm after.
12:16 < _cheerios> I always tend to put too much of my hacks into index.php or something clumsy like that :looks down:
12:16 < Wombert> in fact, that would be a windows experience, since on a mac, the routes would be smart defaults you'd never ever need to change xD
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12:17 < _cheerios> I forgot; "My mouse only has 2 buttons, WTF!" ~~~Mac God Shoots Arrow Of Conversion At User ~~~ "Ah, now I get it, I don't need more than this! This is the best!" ;)
12:17 < _cheerios> oops, 1 button, ofc
12:18 < Wombert> actually, mac mice had four buttons for years ;)
12:20 < _cheerios> So, overall, just something small when hosting the same shit for thousands of people, where each one is a unique snowflake that wants things their way.
12:21 < Wombert> yes
12:21 < Wombert> even though you might want to consider just doing this "by hand"
12:21 < Wombert> because you could also read those routes from a database or so
12:21 < Wombert> but that would mean you cannot have the subdomain stuff in the routing as well
12:22 < _cheerios> The rules are likely read from a db, then saved to an xml, so there's little overhead in doing this.
12:22 < Wombert> look at a compiled routing.xml to see what I mean
12:24 < _cheerios> 6500 lines of eye hurt :p
12:32 < MikeSeth> RossC0: indeed it is your doctrine class. I've just been yelling in everyone's ears to use it :)
12:32 < MikeSeth> RossC0: the HTTP auth is basically this: http://foo:bar@fish/cat
12:33 < MikeSeth> lemme fetch you some code
12:39 < Wombert> not necessarily
12:39 < Wombert> it might be digest auth as well
12:39 < Wombert> and then you cannot pass the credentials via the URL
12:39 < MikeSeth> Wombert: yeah
12:39 < Wombert> but
12:39 < MikeSeth> here's a simple hack I wrote to ride along the normal login procedure
12:39 < MikeSeth> http://pastebin.ca/690123
12:39 < Wombert> I think digest is difficult to do with php
12:41 < MikeSeth> yeah, the obvious problem with plain auth is that it's too easy to sniff out the passwords, but its not really a big threat, and either way you should never do things like this on a public website
12:52 < RossC0> k thanks guys :D
12:53 < RossC0> I'll have a butchers and see if it'll fit :D
13:00 < Wombert> you can of course also just mark it isSecure()
13:00 < Wombert> then in your login action
13:00 < Wombert> you send the headers to show that browser dialog
13:01 < Wombert> the downside is that this still doesn't mean users can just "log in like that" without this dialog
13:04 < MikeSeth> Wombert: well, I specifically wanted only certain accounts to be able to log in like that, and only with c